I'm glad that you all found a middle ground in the form of an additional apartment.
My wife and I have been married for 18 years, of which I was away for 8. I served in the military and had to take multiple assignments away from my family.
Everyone was interested in why we didn't move together, but each scenario had a different reason. In the end, I retired after 24 years of service. My wife also stopped working, so we are both together all day while the two kids are at school.
We each have our own master bedroom. Yes, we live in separate rooms. We love each other deeply, but we are two completely different animals.
She likes to sleep with the TV running and the lights on. I want complete silence and darkness. We both wake up early but at different times.
Every morning, we meet and have our morning coffee and talk before the kids wake up. When the kids leave, we can have a play date in one of our rooms.
So many people ask why we live in different rooms. I just say, "Dude, we lived together for over 18 years; what more do we need to prove?"
Sharing a space is challenging. We must stop looking at movies and believing people are hugging each other all night/every night.
Your husband probably grew up as I did (I'm also black). Black households aren't usually places of emotions and feelings. "Kids need to be seen, not heard" is the mantra.
My wife and I went through tough times in 2020. However, we stuck to it and retired early. All of that stress is gone. Our kids are 17 and 13. Life is good on this side.
By the way, in my opinion, it's much tougher to be the one in the lonely apartment. As a family person, you have a huge void of time assigned to being inside a family.
When you live alone, that time is empty. I was away for three straight years (2 in Japan and 1 in San Diego), and it was the most lonely I have ever been. No kids laughing, no coffee breaks, no fun. Many people form bad habits during this time (drinking).
So be aware of that; it can be a very depressing time, especially if you think a divorce is waiting on the other side.
Good luck in your situation. My kids show no signs of trauma from me being gone for eight years. All of their friends' parents are divorced, and their dad isn't coming back. Theirs did.
Joshua, thank you so much for sharing your own story. I think the more we can talk about all the different arrangements couples have found that work for them, the more we can normalize anything that deviates from what we consider the "norm."
My husband did very much grow up with the "children should be seen and not heard" mantra; additionally, he spent most of his childhood as an only child with a single mother. I keep assuring him that the constant sibling fights, for example, are totally normal, but the chaos of family life can really throw him for a loop!
Thanks for sharing and mentioning me. I felt this like so deeply “But if there’s one thing I’ve learned about parenting, it’s that as soon as you have the audacity to think, “I’ve got this,” everything promptly unravels.”
I’m new to the dad thing, but life got a lot more complicated. When love is about loving a child, I realize how much the marriage is choosing the other person in this season, based off the history you’ve had with them. Especially because so much is always changing so quickly. Appreciate this perspective.
Children really do a number on us! And yes, there are so many seasons of parenting -- it's a constant process of adaptation without a lot of time to proactively problem solve. I can tell from your writing that there is no shortage of love in your family, and while love alone may not always cut it, it's an essential foundation. Looking forward to reading more of your beautiful letters!
No kids, but I've lived in separate houses with the same man for 15 years now. It works SO well. We both need a lot of alone time, and we have it. We don't have to squabble over household stuff. We eat dinner and spend the night together every night, but since we alternate houses, it means half the time one of us doesn't even have to THINK about dinner. And we absolutely have one another's backs.
When I was an interior designer, I had 1 set of clients that lived in separate homes and 3 sets of clients that had separate bedrooms. They all had long-lasting marriages! Their stories made me take a breath and realize not everyone wants to live like everyone else. Other ideas can be logical, sustainable solutions when discussed and negotiated - probably why those relationships were solid!
It does force you to own your own relationship instead of coasting along on social expectations. To ask yourselves "what do we really want?" instead of just being mad at someone for not intuiting it, or "doing it right" ....
Yes it is hard, all of that resonates. And so does the longing for community, less isolation and more help. But I think when we long for this we don’t grapple with the trade off which has always been that other human beings are different from us and demanding and weird and drive us crazy. I don’t think there’s really any way around it - we can have more community and practical help - but it’s not going to be perfectly inclusive and giving support exactly the way you want to receive it - it’s going to occasionally make you want to run away to be a hermit.
It's so true -- being in community can mean a lot more emotional complexity! And it's unlikely you'll actually like or get along with everyone you're in community with. I will say though, reflecting back on times in my life when I've been part of strong communities, I think the trade-offs are generally worth it. I worry that humans these days are so quick to write off people they don't like or who aren't completely politically aligned, but communities teach us how to relate to and work with different people, consider issues from different angles and perspectives, and in the process, develop our empathy muscles. When we're offline, we can't just cancel or block people.
Of course, not all communities are created equal. Some are steeped in dogma, exclusion, and judgment -- I'd personally rather be isolated than be part of that type of community. But at the end of the day, I think we suffer far more in isolation. We're wired to be connected, even when some of the people we're connected to drive us nuts!
Thank you for writing this! We keep the hard parts of marriage so hidden, which is why I think so many people are shocked when couples divorce. This names the hard and the creative ways you are trying to find a new way. Our world loves boxes so much, but they rarely fit us well. I hope this change brings good things for your entire family.
Thank you, Cindy. I hope we can start talking more openly about challenges of marriage and family rearing in the context of modern social realities. It looks like you are doing just that -- I was intrigued by the name of your Substack and just subscribed! Looking forward to reading your stuff.
This was very thought provoking. My husband traveled for work - a lot - which meant parenting was mainly my domain. But I also actualy loved having alone time when I could do whatever the hell I wanted. It is strange how things are constantly changing, especially as the kids grow and their parenting needs and wants evolve. You have to stay on your toes and keep nimble to manage this family thing and absolutely try any alternatives available to make things work. Now my husband has retired and the kids are out of the house our routines have changed again. I'm lucky that we've found a way to make it work for 30+ years. Hang in there and good for you to being open to giving something a try. It's too easy to just complain about the status quo but never find the courage to make changes.
Thank you Sue for sharing a bit of your story! There is something liberating about stretches of solo parenting. And you're so right that marriage and family is a constant evolution of routines and perspectives!
We "live apart together" which is not the same as you describe, but nonetheless has elements of this degree of separation. I like having my own space outside of the family home (which includes teens).
I've been very interested in the "living apart together" movement. A little different from our arrangement, yes, but the same acknowledgment that some physical space and headspace are both helpful and necessary. Especially when we're parenting adolescents! They can be so emotionally draining.
I've written about it in today's post with a portion of it called Utilitarian Mom. Really, the idea of having a space to call my own had been a desire for me since the day the first baby arrived. Do all families go through misalignment phases? It's so odd to think about... Anyway, the idea of living LAT was a foreign concept for me until I moved into my mom's house after she had an accident and needed care-giving for a time. It was then when it suddenly dawned on me that perhaps LAT would suit our needs.
Your article about your husband moving out for different reasons just brought up all these thoughts about individual space and being a mom and family life and... yes, well, that's why I commented. :)
We need to allow for all kinds of ways of living and of having families. I hope you're part of a trend in that direction. Of course, it would help if we had some semblance of community in this country. But we can keep trying.
YES, so many problems could be addressed, if not solved, if we just had stronger (and equitable and diverse and inclusive) communities. I've been trying so hard to focus on that, but everyone is just so busy and distracted, myself included!
You have to do what works for you and your marriage and not worry about what others think. I can relate to so many things you've written about here. I've been married for 14 years and we have two kids together. Covid really did a number on our social lives too. I think it's wise to consider the benefits of having the apartment near your husband's work. I wonder if it will end up being hardest on him to be away and to be missing out on the daily routines. Open lines of communication are key. Thanks for sharing this personal and relatable story.
I'm glad that you all found a middle ground in the form of an additional apartment.
My wife and I have been married for 18 years, of which I was away for 8. I served in the military and had to take multiple assignments away from my family.
Everyone was interested in why we didn't move together, but each scenario had a different reason. In the end, I retired after 24 years of service. My wife also stopped working, so we are both together all day while the two kids are at school.
We each have our own master bedroom. Yes, we live in separate rooms. We love each other deeply, but we are two completely different animals.
She likes to sleep with the TV running and the lights on. I want complete silence and darkness. We both wake up early but at different times.
Every morning, we meet and have our morning coffee and talk before the kids wake up. When the kids leave, we can have a play date in one of our rooms.
So many people ask why we live in different rooms. I just say, "Dude, we lived together for over 18 years; what more do we need to prove?"
Sharing a space is challenging. We must stop looking at movies and believing people are hugging each other all night/every night.
Your husband probably grew up as I did (I'm also black). Black households aren't usually places of emotions and feelings. "Kids need to be seen, not heard" is the mantra.
My wife and I went through tough times in 2020. However, we stuck to it and retired early. All of that stress is gone. Our kids are 17 and 13. Life is good on this side.
By the way, in my opinion, it's much tougher to be the one in the lonely apartment. As a family person, you have a huge void of time assigned to being inside a family.
When you live alone, that time is empty. I was away for three straight years (2 in Japan and 1 in San Diego), and it was the most lonely I have ever been. No kids laughing, no coffee breaks, no fun. Many people form bad habits during this time (drinking).
So be aware of that; it can be a very depressing time, especially if you think a divorce is waiting on the other side.
Good luck in your situation. My kids show no signs of trauma from me being gone for eight years. All of their friends' parents are divorced, and their dad isn't coming back. Theirs did.
Joshua, thank you so much for sharing your own story. I think the more we can talk about all the different arrangements couples have found that work for them, the more we can normalize anything that deviates from what we consider the "norm."
My husband did very much grow up with the "children should be seen and not heard" mantra; additionally, he spent most of his childhood as an only child with a single mother. I keep assuring him that the constant sibling fights, for example, are totally normal, but the chaos of family life can really throw him for a loop!
Thanks for sharing and mentioning me. I felt this like so deeply “But if there’s one thing I’ve learned about parenting, it’s that as soon as you have the audacity to think, “I’ve got this,” everything promptly unravels.”
I’m new to the dad thing, but life got a lot more complicated. When love is about loving a child, I realize how much the marriage is choosing the other person in this season, based off the history you’ve had with them. Especially because so much is always changing so quickly. Appreciate this perspective.
Children really do a number on us! And yes, there are so many seasons of parenting -- it's a constant process of adaptation without a lot of time to proactively problem solve. I can tell from your writing that there is no shortage of love in your family, and while love alone may not always cut it, it's an essential foundation. Looking forward to reading more of your beautiful letters!
No kids, but I've lived in separate houses with the same man for 15 years now. It works SO well. We both need a lot of alone time, and we have it. We don't have to squabble over household stuff. We eat dinner and spend the night together every night, but since we alternate houses, it means half the time one of us doesn't even have to THINK about dinner. And we absolutely have one another's backs.
When I was an interior designer, I had 1 set of clients that lived in separate homes and 3 sets of clients that had separate bedrooms. They all had long-lasting marriages! Their stories made me take a breath and realize not everyone wants to live like everyone else. Other ideas can be logical, sustainable solutions when discussed and negotiated - probably why those relationships were solid!
It does force you to own your own relationship instead of coasting along on social expectations. To ask yourselves "what do we really want?" instead of just being mad at someone for not intuiting it, or "doing it right" ....
This arrangement sounds amazing!!
It's resulted in a deeply egalitarian relationship -- which has been great.
Yes it is hard, all of that resonates. And so does the longing for community, less isolation and more help. But I think when we long for this we don’t grapple with the trade off which has always been that other human beings are different from us and demanding and weird and drive us crazy. I don’t think there’s really any way around it - we can have more community and practical help - but it’s not going to be perfectly inclusive and giving support exactly the way you want to receive it - it’s going to occasionally make you want to run away to be a hermit.
It's so true -- being in community can mean a lot more emotional complexity! And it's unlikely you'll actually like or get along with everyone you're in community with. I will say though, reflecting back on times in my life when I've been part of strong communities, I think the trade-offs are generally worth it. I worry that humans these days are so quick to write off people they don't like or who aren't completely politically aligned, but communities teach us how to relate to and work with different people, consider issues from different angles and perspectives, and in the process, develop our empathy muscles. When we're offline, we can't just cancel or block people.
Of course, not all communities are created equal. Some are steeped in dogma, exclusion, and judgment -- I'd personally rather be isolated than be part of that type of community. But at the end of the day, I think we suffer far more in isolation. We're wired to be connected, even when some of the people we're connected to drive us nuts!
Thank you for writing this! We keep the hard parts of marriage so hidden, which is why I think so many people are shocked when couples divorce. This names the hard and the creative ways you are trying to find a new way. Our world loves boxes so much, but they rarely fit us well. I hope this change brings good things for your entire family.
Thank you, Cindy. I hope we can start talking more openly about challenges of marriage and family rearing in the context of modern social realities. It looks like you are doing just that -- I was intrigued by the name of your Substack and just subscribed! Looking forward to reading your stuff.
This was very thought provoking. My husband traveled for work - a lot - which meant parenting was mainly my domain. But I also actualy loved having alone time when I could do whatever the hell I wanted. It is strange how things are constantly changing, especially as the kids grow and their parenting needs and wants evolve. You have to stay on your toes and keep nimble to manage this family thing and absolutely try any alternatives available to make things work. Now my husband has retired and the kids are out of the house our routines have changed again. I'm lucky that we've found a way to make it work for 30+ years. Hang in there and good for you to being open to giving something a try. It's too easy to just complain about the status quo but never find the courage to make changes.
Thank you Sue for sharing a bit of your story! There is something liberating about stretches of solo parenting. And you're so right that marriage and family is a constant evolution of routines and perspectives!
You go girl
We "live apart together" which is not the same as you describe, but nonetheless has elements of this degree of separation. I like having my own space outside of the family home (which includes teens).
I've been very interested in the "living apart together" movement. A little different from our arrangement, yes, but the same acknowledgment that some physical space and headspace are both helpful and necessary. Especially when we're parenting adolescents! They can be so emotionally draining.
I've written about it in today's post with a portion of it called Utilitarian Mom. Really, the idea of having a space to call my own had been a desire for me since the day the first baby arrived. Do all families go through misalignment phases? It's so odd to think about... Anyway, the idea of living LAT was a foreign concept for me until I moved into my mom's house after she had an accident and needed care-giving for a time. It was then when it suddenly dawned on me that perhaps LAT would suit our needs.
Your article about your husband moving out for different reasons just brought up all these thoughts about individual space and being a mom and family life and... yes, well, that's why I commented. :)
We need to allow for all kinds of ways of living and of having families. I hope you're part of a trend in that direction. Of course, it would help if we had some semblance of community in this country. But we can keep trying.
YES, so many problems could be addressed, if not solved, if we just had stronger (and equitable and diverse and inclusive) communities. I've been trying so hard to focus on that, but everyone is just so busy and distracted, myself included!
You have to do what works for you and your marriage and not worry about what others think. I can relate to so many things you've written about here. I've been married for 14 years and we have two kids together. Covid really did a number on our social lives too. I think it's wise to consider the benefits of having the apartment near your husband's work. I wonder if it will end up being hardest on him to be away and to be missing out on the daily routines. Open lines of communication are key. Thanks for sharing this personal and relatable story.
Thanks Kristina, and yes, I'm already anticipating that the transitions between routines will be the hardest on all of us. We'll see how it goes!
I don't *need* your approval, but I certainly don't mind it! Thank you, and best of luck in your journey!